Example Four: Is Hated for Mysterious Reasons by People Close to Them

Since YWL wouldn't allow me to get genuinely close to him (despite him saying that I was "so important" to him and he could only "really talk to" me. And him telling myself and my best friend how "devastated" he was to lose my respect and friendship... all I really have to go on is the emails I've gotten since I started this blog. I won't reveal the who-s... yes, I know that's suspect... but I don't feel that I should put people's trust in jeopardy. Ever. 

Suffice it to say I have gotten a lot of email on this blog from people who deal YWL on a fairly frequent basis. They describe the same odd, self-involved, inappropriate and downright rude behavior from him that I saw in college. Only now it has gotten a LOT worse. 
 

I feel bad for people who have to tolerate YWL for a variety of reasons. I even tried to talk a couple of them into seeing something positive about him. Yes... that's right. Me. But they can't and I understand that. 

What's really bad is I do understand how having to act phony to be around someone you hate makes an honest person feel about themselves. That you are lowering yourself to the level of someone like YWL. That, I get. 

Here's what my late friend Kathy Krajco had to say about this trait:

In fact, another red flag is being hated -- I mean really hated -- for mysterious reasons. And by people that hating is uncharacteristic of.

If, say, a person's adult son or daughter doesn't even visit him in the hospital or go to his funeral,* there is a heavy-duty reason for that. Fortunately, it's not our responsibility to judge. But we do need to appreciate the weight of such a startling fact. People do things for reasons. They are not always good reasons or just reasons, but people do things for reasons.

*Good examples: Abraham Lincoln did not go to his father's funeral, and Barbara Bush did not go to her mother's funeral.

"What Makes Narcissists Tick", pg. 79

And here's what my friend Anna Valerious has to say:

This red flag is well understood by those of us who have been through hell with a narcissist and found ourselves loathing them and forcing no contact for our protection. We would be very unlikely to judge someone else harshly if we found out they had inordinate hatred for a particular person even a parent or sibling. So this red flag is one most of us would readily understand.

Unfortunately, most people out there in the world do not have any of this understanding. They are far too quick to judge what they don't know. They are quick to condemn our hatred of a malignant narcissist as being wrong. They are naive to a fault about people who are capable of earning such hatred -- so they condemn us.

This red flag should be put on billboards and written with sky-writing: Respect the fact that people do things for reasons therefore don't be willing to judge what you know nothing of.

Remember, Kathy is talking about a mysterious, intense hatred for a particular person in someone whom you know doesn't go around routinely hating people. Narcissists, on the other hand, have a very long "enemies list" so it can't be said it is uncharacteristic of them to hate others. It is their default and normal setting. But when you meet someone who typically gets along well with most people then know for sure that if they hate someone there is a reason for it.

It isn't for you to judge whether or not the reason is "good." Frankly, it isn't anyone's damn business.

 

Do I hate YWL? No. Hate is active. I have had a few people I considered really good friends at one time suddenly do the most unconscionable things to me. My therapist and I went through these things one by one and often we found these people probably had some sort of personality disorder; since I was a target for them. Second, they often did things just as bad or worse to others... so it wasn't "personal." And hating people that do that takes too much energy. 

People like YWL aren't worth my wasting my energy on when there are other things I can and DO do that serve a much better and more healing purpose.

I do hate what he does - like using women and lying about it. I do his view of women as warm plumbing and the things he does to coerce sex out of them... including paying for it.

He also denies hating me "four years ago"... with the underlying 'unsaid' being "but I hate you now for exposing my secret life you bitch." (subtleas a brick) In fact he said he didn't have "time" for hate for a couple reasons in this exchange... yet I was shown that within a few hours he was posting some of these things around the net. 

I do hate how he made me feel. I do hate why he did this to me. And I do hate people who lie and who try to 'drum up' support for a smear campaign to cover their misdeeds. You know - the "she's a scorned woman, bunny boiler, crazy, psycho, stalker... blah blah blah." Yes, THAT nonsense I hate.  About anyone. It's childish and its a big neon sign of lying, in part, to divert people away from the truth. 

YWL implied that I have such an 'out of control ego' that I am simply angry because he didn't love me and because he wouldn't "bang" me. Pure projection.  He also has a bridge in Brooklyn for sale, I hear.

I do hate liars. And particularly people who lie to exploit and coerce others - men, women... anyone who abuses someone's trust in them to get what they want. 

(And I hate the terrorists that attacked NYC on 9/11 - a lot of us NYers took that personally. I still do.) 

  I always say to my children "I don't hate you but I do hate your behavior." This applies to YWL also.  

What about your sociopath or narcissist? Do you hate them?
-------------------------

XXXXX@mail.net 2009-12-26 07:52:10 - Submitted on 2009/12/26 at 1:49am 

Barbara I wanted to thank you so much for all the investigative work you have done over time on the many different techniques that can be used on the human mind/psyche to brainwash and/ or hypnotize a person. I feel some of this was attempted on me and up until I read some of the stuff on your site about hypnosis and brainwashing, I hadn't a clue as to how very real that stuff is! Frightening. And by the way Barbara, I have read about this monster that caused you so much pain and mental and emotional & physical anguish – I read many of the links and have seen his pic, read his political blog, and the other links that showed where he rated escorts, all of that. It was truly an amazing insight into how sick and depraved the human mind can become – so thank you for posting it and being so honest. 

He’s obviously sexually perverted and lacking basic morals and integrity all the while trying to portray himself as an upstanding intellectual in the political & religious communities he rubs elbows in. He may say he’s changed – but we all know these types never change… they just get sneakier. He is beyond pathetic, beyond disgusting. 

Barbara, you are an angel… your honesty is helping me heal. God bless you.

Example Three: Has a History of Past Upheavals

If you know a narcissist's history, you will usually see a track of mysterious upheavals in his life. He suddenly up and moves to a different school or job in a different town every few years. That is, every time the good angels in his Pathological Space start comparing notes, get his number, and become enraged. In one narcissist I know of, these upheavals began with one in the eighth grade. " What Makes Narcissists Tick" pg. 79

In other words, once the narcissist has crapped enough in one place and it begins to stink they have to move on. The pile of excrement near the narcissist has made it clear to others who is doing the crapping. All that dung is what we call 'exposure'. Thus requiring a new scene for the narcissist.

With YWL it's not only exposure... but not getting his way or people disagreeing with him.

Instance one with me: In December 1976, YWL packed up and left the college we were attending and went to another. I didn't know where he went, he never bothered to even tell me he was going - where he was going - or keep in touch. The next time I heard from him was April 2002 when HE (yes HE) looked me up on Classmates.com. I have the first email and the police found his Classmates account and retrieval of my email to contact me, which blows the nonsense he's been spreading about me stalking him for years out of the water.  

Now prior to leaving, his roommate, David - was teasing him relentlessly. YWL introduced David and I and David dominated my life for the next 3 years. (I didn't find out until a couple weeks before I graduated that David was obsessed with me, that others knew about his obsession and waited until the bitter end to tell me. David tried to kill me and control my whole life... David was, I believe, the first sociopath I ever dealt with personally.) 

David had asked YWL if he'd ever slept with me. You see, David was enamored with me at the time and he asked me about my relationship with YWL and I was HONEST! I said 'yes, that I cared about YWL.' 

  YWL later told me (to cover his derriere) that he didn't think it was anyone's business rather than admitting he lied. (The fact that he published reviews of all the escorts he saw on a number of Hooker-Review-Sites tells me he thinks his amoral exploits are EVERYONE'S business!) 

There's a big difference between that and OUTRIGHT LYING! Which is what he did... and in a typically cruel and hurtful way.  

A bunch of us were in YWL and David's room. I was sitting at the end of David's bed with our friend Dan, looking out the window. I audibly heard David ask YWL if he'd been intimate with me. YWL's response is one I never forgot.
 

"HER?? I would NEVER sleep with her! She's not my type. Besides she's not even Jewish."

I got up an excused myself from the room. Didn't tell anyone I'd heard that dagger in my stomach. 

But YWL had been blowing me off and avoiding me since he started rooming with David. This "I would NEVER..." incident did it for me. I started to ignore YWL and avoid him too. 

YWL wasn't quite done with harming me. Sociopathic types never are with open-hearted people. No. Just before he packed up and left, YWL told David that yes, in fact he HAD been intimate with me. And then bolted the school and any responsibilities he may have had towards anyone there.  

The result? When I returned from Winter Break in early January 1977, David called my room (which was right downstairs) and asked me to come up. He'd obviously been ruminating over the break. He'd called my home a few times during break to chat, saying he missed me, but said nothing about this revelation. 

But now, I walked into David's room and he grabbed me by the shoulders and yelled that YWL had confirmed that we had been intimate and that he was furious with me! I was pushed/ thrown into YWL's old now-empty closet. I got up and ran downstairs, locking myself in my room. 

This was the beginning of the contentious campaign and dramatically covert abusive relationship David ran on me almost until we graduated. I am lucky to be alive. And I never heard an apology from YWL, nor anying "owning" of the results of his behavior towards me ever.   REMORSELESS.

This history of past upheavals can be more subtle than the narcissist having to physically pull up stakes and move to a new place. This is what Kathy is talking about though. If you are acquainted with someone who keeps telling you about how they had to get rid of this person, that person and the other person where all the blame rests on the other party or they had to get away -- you are witnessing a "history of past upheavals" and it is a sign you are looking at a narcissist. Moving about geographically is only one outward sign of past upheavals. High turnover in social circles and relationships is the subtler sign. I call it subtler because it requires a knowledge of that person's social history for you to follow the trend.

YWL later put me on the defensive (see article excerpts at the bottom of this post) by saying that he thought "David made me hate [him]." Not that he'd put me on the curb like garbage when he was done using me. No... somehow HE was the victim!  

YWL also says that HE broke up the 5 year engagement relationship between himself and his ex-fiance (the person he says he SHOULD have married). I wonder about that. From what he told me, if there was any truth to it... it was volatile and revolved around sex, sex and more sex. (who knows what was real and what wasn't there)  

YWL also has a poor job history since 2001. Lots of periods of unemployment. Whether it be redundancy, turnover or just bad timing... this guy's having a lot of problems maintaining income. 

He looked me up online during a period of unemployment and manipulated, brainwashed and lied to me to turn me into some 'online freebie.' Something I would never have been on my own if I wasn't brainwashed!

Kathy stated that, "every time the good angels in his Pathological Space start comparing notes, get his number, and become enraged" that it forces the narcissist to fold up his tent and move away. It is possible that the narcissist you know has managed to arrange a Pathological Space where there are no "good angels" to hold him or her to account.

Remember YWL's lame apology about what happened? I know Elizabeth mentioned numerous times how he PROMISED her he'd be back in touch once he calmed his wife down. She had a very hard time believing she'd been dumped so quickly. But once she did realize it - she was enraged. 

I myself, have never heard from him again - and hope I never do. Just the thought of attempting to be polite to him again and his backward reaction to anything makes my stomach churn.

Sometimes the narcissist is able to form a family circle (or any social circle) in which there are no dissenters. Either the dissenters have fled or have been forcefully ousted by the majority rule of the narcissist and his underlings.

This scenario of the narcissist gaining a large enough mass of sychophants, enablers, beta narcissists in his Pathological Space means it can camoflage this red flag to onlookers and acquaintances. Beware.

In this case look for a cult following. If you find a person with a cult-leader type of effect on the people in his social circle then you can be damned sure you're looking at a narcissist. In a cult-type setting it always looks like the "Cult Leader" is the immovable rock never having to vacate his setting but forcing out those who don't fit in. It is a fake-out form of stability. Remember that families can be cult-like in construct.

This may or may not be what is going on with YWL's family and friends - I don't know but from what I've heard it is: no dissent allowed. (Another reason why he's such a good example for people to understand this type of Pathological) 

Oddly, YWL did tell me (the police & my lawyer have the verified chats) many times that his mother and sister sexually abused him when he was a child, numerous times. Looking for sympathy again with a constructed lie?

Click here for another example of YWL's lack of tolerance for a difference of opinion and getting as far away from debate and fair discussion as possible; unapologetically.  

To finish the example here, some excerpts from a wonderful article by Steve Becker, LSCW:

Accepting the Blame to Preserve the Relationship

Here’s a theme I think we can relate to: Your partner (a male in this example, strictly for convenience’s sake)—a narcissist, or perhaps sociopath—blames you for his misery, bad moods, bad decisions, frustrations, dissatisfactions, disappointments and underfulfillment. From his perspective, if he cheats on you—or deceives and betrays you—you will have deserved it, because you will have been responsible for the discontent that necessitated his violating behaviors. Remember he feels entitled to have what he wants; he deserves what he wants, when he wants it; and if he’s frustrated, it must be someone’s fault. Someone must be blamed, and you, his partner, will be his odds-on choice to own his blame.
 

It’s amazing how often we accept, against our better instincts, the narcissistic/sociopathic partner’s insistence that we are responsible for his infinite emptiness.

 

We do so for many reasons, but the one I’d like to stress is this: If we don’t accept this responsibility, his blame, we seriously risk losing the relationship.

..............

   

A couple I spent some time with recently (clinically) illustrated this point well. The husband, Harold, was one of the most transparent narcissistic personalities I’ve ever seen. He’d recently ended an affair with a colleague (justifying the affair as a function of his right to pursue the fulfillment his spouse, Julia, wasn’t supplying). ......... But while recognizing these alarming warnings, she was already too deeply invested in her vision of the relationship—and Harold—to end it. 
-------------------------

On a final note, YWL 'justified' his 'relationships' with both myself and Elizabeth by telling both of us (remember verified copies of chats are on file) that his wife was cold, pious, hated sex, he was sooooo lonely, he NEEDED, he couldn't handle the lack of love/ sex... etc... There is NO JUSTIFICATION for the depraved games a pathological grooms & lures us into. None whatsoever. The blame is solely theirs.  

Kathy Krajco's Example Four: is Hated for Mysterious Reasons by People Close to Them - is next. It will probably be short because a lot of it is covered in this post!

Example Two: Damages the Images of Most Others

This one's almost too easy. So I am going to do the obvious, with a disclaimer -- For some image damaging: YWL's blog. Just read it. 

That said, let me add that on my personal blog, I vent my spleen on a lot of politicians and other persons who's actions harm others and that I have deep disagreement with. I am a Mayflower descendant and a Daughter of the American Revolution so for me - it's practically a birthright. YWL and myself and every blogger out there has every right to say whatever we want about whoever we want AS LONG AS IT'S OPINION OR WE CAN BACK IT UP WITH HARD FACTS.
 

Unfortunately, YWL went the extra step with me... he posted things that he wants and NEEDS people to believe I did - which I did not, could not and would not. 

(The funny thing I find is that this "STORY OF..." went a lot further than me. He'd been using that nickname a loooooong time before me - which I learned from what law enforcement turned up on him. I was a small blip in that sordid 'STORY') 

 

He made sure to tell these things to people who don't know me, don't know my character and others who he's made damn sure will never know me - like his wife. Aside from this post of his... (and his comments here, since he tried to scrub this off his blog) there are a few other things have trickled down to me from people who he's spoken to about me like, I AM:

• a predator
• obsessed with him
• lost my virginity to him so I am fixated on him for life
• stalking him (online and off)
• harassing him
• lying about him
• making things up or planting lies online
• a bunny boiler
• a scorned woman
• a horror

...and many other minor, juvenile things.  ALL VERIFIABLY INCORRECT!!!
 

The narcissist will project that off onto the most conspicuously well spoken person in the group, someone who avoids gossip and never spreads vicious rumors about others, someone who often praises and speaks well of other people instead. Therefore, you have to be a complete idiot to believe the narcissist when he tells you that this person is maligning him. - Kathy Krajco

Let me comment on each of these assertions of his one by one just to make the point about how these Pathologicals operate:  

A Predator - I'm not the one who labeled him a predator. EOPC did, in their educated opinion labeled him that. So he engaged in projection. As far as what EOPC opines helps make him a predator, from what myself and Elizabeth told them: I have never used online dating ever; I never scoured the reunion sites looking for old 'friends'; I have never used hookers; I have never had sex without emotion on my part; I have never posted online about using hookers and I have never used 'friends' as leverage to get to their other friends to try to start affairs. I also never ever physically cheated on my ex-husband. 

Obsessed with Him - Most victims of pathologicals go through a period of trying to 'figure it all out' and deprogramming from the brainwashing and gaslighting pathologicals do. Therapists and Counselors told me it can take over 18 months and I can safely say I am way beyond that now. Despite it taking me years for the cognitive dissonance to wear off, I simply don't have the time or inclination to be obsessed with anyone but my children. 

I 'lost my virginity to' him so I 'am fixated" - No. I was not a virgin when we were intimate first time in the Fall of 1975. I did bleed all over him and 2 days later had to go to the Student Health Center to be checked out and found I had internal bruising and tearing. Something the other 2 people I had been intimate with did not do to me.  

By the way, YWL never called or came by my dorm to check on me or did anything to find out if I was o.k. afterward. An early red flag that he couldn't care less but I was too young and uneducated about these types to know.  

Stalking Him (online and off) - No. I turned everything over to law enforcement in March 2004. I had no computer for over a year and MY online activity was monitored, as I believe was his. I enforce no contact - which is fine as I know he will never speak to me again. As far as offline, no way. It's over an hour, one way to his house and because of my disability I can't always sit and drive that far for that long. His accusations are about middle-of-the-night things. 

He's also accused a friend of mine of doing this for me. Sorry, she and I are both single mothers and have no time or reason to bundle up our children in the middle of the night to go to his house and do whatever-it-is-we-supposedly-did. I think I have been in his county maybe 2 times in the last year to go shopping. But I have no intention of following him in person nor am I physically well enough to do so. My doctors would attest to this. (And did to the Detective he and his wife went to and told I was 'stalking' him. Of course, he provided no real proof just words.)  

Harassing Him - No. I don't need more of his endless narcissistic rage. I am too ill and my PTSD issues are permanent now. I need to expend energy on my children and my own health. He simply isn't important enough to me. I can not, however, control what Elizabeth Green does or does not do... although I have taken enough blame for it.  

Lying About Him - No reason to do so. Hence this blog with some evidence. I have absolutely nothing to gain by lying about him. I also had plenty to lose by telling the truth, but I did so for my own healing. Besides I am a bad liar and always have been. Again - this is projection.  

Making Things Up or Planting Lies Online - No. YWL demanded a while back I get posts about him taken down. He of course, didn't care to follow up ("she wants me to listen. NO WAY BITCH") that I couldn't get things taken down, though I did try. Why?  

BECAUSE AS MANY OF THE SITES TOLD ME AND I FORWARDED THE EMAILS TO HIM - THEIR REASON: I WAS NOT THE PERSON WHO POSTED THEM THERE 

IN THE FIRST PLACE! 

 Besides, what he did to me was so monstrous, there is no need to be a "good emglisher" (as he claimed to be in his first threat towards me). It's unbelievable enough to those who have never dealt with a Pathological.
 

A Bunny Boiler - I like bunnies. I love animals and most of my pets have been very protective of me. I couldn't dissect a frog in high school and I certainly would never boil a bunny. My doctor will also tell you, I am allergic to game food.

A Scorned Woman - How old & tired is this comment? As if women can't be angry or upset when someone craps all over them? I guess we're not allowed to get peeved when someone plays with our mind, uses us for sex and lies about us every chance they get. And Elizabeth will tell you, I offered a few times to totally back off so she & he could be happy together. And I offered to help him find help for the "bad marriage" he convinced me he was stuck in. And NO, I don't want him. I am not the least bit 'jealous' of his wife nor am I upset that, as he says he "wouldn't f*ck" me. Why would I be jealous when I kept saying NO to him and kept telling him to work on his marriage? (I have all the verified chats to prove this). Nothing to be jealous of, really.  

A Horror - All I can say is I don't go out much but when I do, I have never seen people look at me and run away screaming or crying. When YWL and I had lunch in September 2003 he tried to make fun of me "dyeing" my hair. I can safely say I haven't dyed my hair since my acting career had to stop in 1995 and I have plenty of gray hair now to prove that.

 

Pathologicals say & do many things to make themselves look good. One of the main ways - is damaging the images of most others. Many times YWL said a few times his ex-fiance, Robyn's husband, Marty was "gay." He questioned if my ex-husband is "gay." (Even though the police and my attorney still have the chat where he asked if I could set him up with one of my gay friends so he could 'try it out.'  INSENSITIVE!)

What is even more nasty and odd is that when he found out I have a number of gay male friends, he first called me a "fag hag" then asked if I could find out if one of them would be willing to have sex with him one time so he could know what that was like. Don't worry I didn't even consider doing it!

What a Narcissist Does to Those He Slanders

by Kathy Krajco  

One of the tricks of the dramatic fiction-writing trade is to know, and focus on, a particular aspect of human nature. It is this: Every person's most precious possession is the image of him- or her-self that each carries around inside. 

Fact: People will do ANYTHING to preserve and protect it. Fact: Nobody can bear to have that be the image of an evil person. This is why character assassination is the fate worse than death. That's why it's called "destroying" a person. This is why it drives people to murder and suicide. 

 Even criminals who have committed violent crimes treasure a self concept of themselves as essentially good inside. And many, perhaps even most, are. Storytellers exploit this by creating a situation in which the hero's self-concept is threatened. That's automatic maximum motivation. 

For example, Hamlet's self concept is that of an honorable man. So Shakespeare has his father's brother come along and seduce his mother, murder his father the king, and then stain the throne of Denmark with an incestuous marriage to his mother in order to keep the throne from going to Prince Hamlet as it should. What are people going to think of Hamlet if he goes along with this? If he just looks the other way at the murder of his own father? What is Hamlet going to think of himself?

But it's a Catch-22, because everyone else is sucking up to the usurper, so they dishonestly view Hamlet as crazy for suspecting the usurper and will condemn him as evil for doing justice. So, Hamlet is damned as a bad person either way. 

If you put a character like Hamlet in a predicament like this, you have yourself a whopper of a story with it's own engine roaring and ready to go. Since before recorded history, there have been stories of ghosts. According to legend, not just anyone who dies could become a ghost. A ghost was someone who could not rest in peace. He could not accept what had happened to him. Usually that's because he was murdered in some diabolical way, either as Hamlet's father was or as Jesus of Nazareth was -- by being framed and executed for crimes he never committed. He died a criminal.
 

Put yourself in his shoes. Could you tolerate that? No. Nobody can. Nobody can tolerate the whole world believing they're evil when they're not, especially when the person who has falsely accused them is the evil one and comes out smelling like a rose. That turns the whole world upside down, making good evil and evil good. It is an INTOLERABLE state of affairs! Human nature cannot abide it. Indeed, even the blessed spirits in Heaven are said to be unable to stand it. For, that's precisely what started the mythical war in Heaven between St. Michael the Archangel and Lucifer, who later became known as Satan (which means the "accuser" or "character assassin").

 

That's the reasoning upon which is founded the belief that Jesus will return. The early Christians expected him to return to Jerusalem any day, with an army of angels. Do you think that he would have been in a good mood? They didn't. Who did they think they were fooling? Me? I'd know I hadn't fooled him, and I'd be scared shitless of anybody I did that to. So, what would you do if someone you had done that to returned returned with great power? Tremble, eh?  

That's why the traditional representations of the Second Coming are of it as "a day of wrath, a dreadful day." In this upside down world Jesus is the bad guy and the Sanhedrin and the people of Jerusalem are the good guys. Like St. Michael the Archangel, he is going to turn the world right-side up again by giving the real bad guys the reputation they deserve. You needn't be a Christian to get the import of this story. The narcissist plays the part of the Sanhedrin (which was indeed narcissistic and envious of Jesus). The people of Jerusalem play the part of everyone who listens to his slander and calumny of you, even though it flies in face of the facts of your known conduct, gobbling it up just because it's juicy and because condemning others makes them feel righteous. 

If, say, this happens in the workplace, Pontius Pilate plays the part of the boss. There is nothing worse you can do to a human being. So, if this has happened to you, your feelings are natural. Don't make it worse by feeling guilty about them and trying to bury them. You cannot accept it. But you can accept your feelings. So do. You just hunger and thirst for justice. What's so bad about that? If you bide your time, maybe someday you'll get it. 

But unfortunately, you probably won't, because there's very little true justice in this world. That place has been diseased and corrupted by the malignant influence of the narcissist. So just leave it, and kick its dust from your feet as unfit habitation for decent people. Indeed, would you rather trade places with them? He owns them. He doesn't own you.  

SOURCE 





The next will be Number Three: They Have a History of Past Upheavals. Feel free to post YOUR examples from your Pathological here, too!